059 Two Ticket Holder transcript (Eddie Money)

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[00:00:00] Michael: Famous and gravy listeners. Michael Osborne here. Before we get to today's episode, I have a favor to ask. Amit and I were recently nominated for a Signal Award for Best Gateway Podcast. Signal Award recognizes excellence in audio, and this category, Best Gateway Podcast, is about a show that brings in new audiences.

[00:00:21] It's a really exciting honor. We're a finalist, but to win the award, we need people to vote for us. It's a people's choice award. So we are hoping that you will take a brief minute to go and vote for our show. If you like Famous and Gravy and you think we're doing good work here, a vote from you would really mean a lot.

[00:00:38] That's it. Thanks so much. And now I will hand

[00:00:41] it over to Amit.

[00:00:42] Amit: This is Famous and Gravy. Life lessons from dead celebrities. Now for the opening quiz to reveal today's dead celebrity.

[00:00:50] Michael: This person died 2019, age 70. He and his family had been the focus of a reality television show

[00:01:00] on AXS TV.

[00:01:02] Friend: Tom Waits isn't dead, is he?

[00:01:04] Michael: I don't believe so. Uh, that's a good guess. He was the son of a police officer, and he was headed for that career himself when he dropped out of the New York Police Academy to move to San Francisco in pursuit of rock stardom.

[00:01:17] Friend: Wow. Uh, Marty Phelan.

[00:01:21] Michael: I'm afraid I don't know who that is, but it's not this person.

[00:01:23] Friend: Uh, Jefferson Airplane.

[00:01:25] Michael: Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, of course. He struggled with drugs in the early 1980s, but he staged several comebacks and found hits later that decade.

[00:01:36] Friend: They all suffer from drug problems. Um, San Francisco Music, Scott McKenzie.

[00:01:43] Michael: Not Scott McKenzie. Alright. His birth name was Edward Mahoney.

[00:01:48] Friend: Oh! Oh my god! Eddie Money!

[00:01:51] Michael: Today's dead celebrity is Eddie Money.

[00:01:55] Friend: Oh wow. I didn't know he went to San Francisco. I knew he lived in New York.

[00:02:02] Archival: You're back in New York, your home turf, your success. You got two hit singles under the belt. How does it feel to be back home, and I guess on your own terms? Is it exciting? I'm nervous. My mother's here tonight. Your mother's here tonight. Well, do you work better live or in the studio? I think I'm a better live performer, but when I make my records, I make them pretty much live. I don't use that many overdubs. I'm not like a band that takes two or three years to make another record. I believe in going in the studio. If I can get the bass and drums, the rhythm guitar, the rhythm piano, all together on one take, I'd do it, because I believe that... Rock and roll should be spontaneous and live, and it shouldn't be really too difficult.

[00:02:39] Michael: Welcome to Famous Gravy. I'm Michael Osborne.

[00:02:42] Amit: And my name is Amit Kapoor. Michael and I are looking for ways to make life better.

[00:02:47] Michael: And we believe that the best years might lie ahead. So on this show, we choose a celebrity who died in the last 10 years, and we go through a series of categories reviewing their lives to extract wisdom and inspiration.

[00:03:00] At the end, we answer the question, would I want that life? Today, Eddie Money. Died 2019, age 70. Category 1. Wait, baby hold on. God damn it. I'm going right into it. That's gonna come up again. Category 1, grading the first line of their obituary. Eddie Money, whose string of rock hits in the late 1970s and 80s included Baby Hold On and Two Tickets to Paradise Died on Friday in Los Angeles, he was 70.

[00:03:37] Amit: A little short, huh? Ugh, you think?

[00:03:39] Michael: Yeah. Yeah! I was insulted. Yeah, there's no, um... I am insulted, I am pissed off about this one. Where is the color of money here? There's nothing! There's nothing in here! Yes. There's two hits, and I don't even know if they're the ones I would have chosen. I would have at least considered, I wanna go back, and absolutely, Take Me Home Tonight.

[00:03:56] Yes. Like, that, these are earwormy songs, for sure, but, Like, there is nothing in here,

[00:04:01] Amit: Amit! Yeah. Eddie money was born, sang two songs and died.

[00:04:06] Michael: I don't like it at all. So I actually read this and I was like, okay, we grade this thing on a scale of one to 10, right? Yeah. What is a one? Is it like factually inaccurate?

[00:04:17] Is it insulting? Is it like, cause that's

[00:04:20] Amit: where I'm at. Yeah, I think so. I think to get to the lowest of the low, yes, there must be a complete inaccuracy. Or, like you said, insulting in some way. But that doesn't happen, they issue corrections. A complete disrespect for a life that does not deserve disrespect.

[00:04:33] Michael: This is gonna come up again, this thing about disrespect. I, String of Rockets, this gives him absolutely no personality. It says nothing about the story. Look, I'm not like an Eddie Money diehard or anything like that. But I read this and thought, are you kidding me? There was time to do a lot better on this.

[00:04:51] Amit: Yes, totally. So The man was 70, and had been diagnosed with

[00:04:54] Michael: cancer. Uh, I mean, if you and I were going to rewrite this, you know, I think you could have said, like, blue collar rock star. That comes up a lot. I mean, even just the word Rockstar. Yes. Like, he could have been the bassist for all we know. Yeah,

[00:05:09] Amit: exactly.

[00:05:09] That's what it sounds like. It sounds like the drummer that, like, we'd never heard about. Totally. There's no personality to it. There's no before and after. And like you said in the before, you can say unlikely rockstar, rose from blue collar, uh, from a. family of cops, or the after, the things he did after.

[00:05:23] He was on his own reality show at the

[00:05:25] Michael: time of death. Absolutely. You know, unlikely. I would have liked the word unlikely in here somewhere. And the rest of the obit actually gets into this stuff, but this first line has zero intrigue. And you miss a lot. I think we'll get into it. There is something actually to be learned from this man's life.

[00:05:41] This gets at none of that. So I'm very pissed off. I have my score. Ah, go

[00:05:45] Amit: ahead,

[00:05:45] Michael: sir. Two. Okay. And the only reason I'm not giving it a one is that there's nothing inaccurate. And, Two Tickets to Paradise. I mean, that needs to be in the first line of his obituary. Yeah, I

[00:05:56] Amit: don't think they did wrong in the two songs that they chose.

[00:05:58] I see your fury, I will match it. But, I'm gonna raise it one, um, because I don't think it was insulting. You don't The absence was insulting. There was no deprecating language, I'm

[00:06:10] Michael: saying. Isn't that Is

[00:06:13] Amit: omission itself deprecating? It is to me. Possibly so, but for me, direct inference needs to be there for a two, so I'm at a

[00:06:20] Michael: three.

[00:06:20] Okay, two and a three. Come on, New York Times. Let's move on. Category two, five things I love about you. Here, Amit and I work to come up with five reasons why we love this person, why we want to be talking about them in the first place. I'll start. This is obvious, but it, it matters, and I think it needs to be talked about.

[00:06:40] Ernestness. Ernestness. I really like this man's earnestness. Okay. I mean, Eddie Money is as earnest as they come, and I think that this is the quality that connected him with his fans. Like, this is, this man is very imperfect and deeply flawed as a rock star, so much so it's kind of unbelievable, and he finds success despite it all, I think because of his earnestness.

[00:07:03] So, there's a ton of retrospectives about Eddie Money out there. I read, Stuff in the New Yorker and the Washington Post. There was one in Rolling Stone by a guy named David Brown. I'm going to read a few excerpts from his Eddie Money retrospective. He was rock and rolls endearing every palooka. A clumsy, somewhat overwrought guy.

[00:07:22] Palooka. I know, it's a good word, right? His stage moves were always a little gawky and spasmodic, his borderline hoarse voice in need of a lozenge or two. He preferred his rock and roll almost proudly, unabashedly generic. Again, this is a fan. He threw himself into songs and stage shows with a sloppy passion.

[00:07:42] I really like that phrase. Rock lyrics don't get any more generic than those in Think I'm In Love or Baby Hold On, but he sang them and other songs as if he believed in them fully, in every single word, and that his life depended on conveying them with as much intensity as he could.

[00:08:11] That is Eddie Money 218. And then finally, there was nothing remotely subtle about any of those songs or their arrangements, but he made you root for him, especially since so many of his songs amounted to confessions about how much he'd screwed up one way or the other. I think that there's like this guilty pleasure thing with Eddie Money.

[00:08:30] I will never play an Eddie Money song with anybody else in the room, but if you catch me in the car and one of his songs comes on, I might just sing along, right? I also think that there is this, this kind of goes along with earnestness. I think he's most effective when there's this, like, romantic nostalgia.

[00:08:48] The song, I Wanna Go Back, has always done something, and I think I saw it when, you know, when I was like, 10 or 11 or 12 or something, and there's something very heartwarming about that, like, I wish I could go back and do it all over, right? But I can't go back. I actually really Kind of love those lyrics. I think it's a very familiar feeling to face regret or relive great experiences, whatever it may be.

[00:09:10] I also think, um, Take Me Home Tonight, I never put it together before doing the research on this episode that the line Be My Little Baby was a callback to the Ronettes and Ronnie Spector singing Be My Little Baby. Yes. And he, there's this great story about like, he drags her out of retirement, essentially.

[00:09:28] It's like, I'm not going to perform this song unless you sing that line. But even that is sort of like, you know, caught up in nostalgic romance.

[00:09:35] Amit: Totally. And that was also, uh, the first live callback. Yes, I saw it. The first live sample in a song.

[00:09:51] Michael: I'm not the world's biggest Eddie Money fan, but I do, like, really appreciate that kind of earnestness. I mean, there is a... made you want to feel these things as if his life depended on it? Like, I really appreciate that in somebody, and I think I desire it, too. You know, I, I, I like somebody who's so caught up in passion that whether you like it or not, you're like, you're rooting for him.

[00:10:12] You know? I'm kind of won over by Eddie Money, and I think it's because of his earnestness, and I think it's his superpower as a rock star. So, that's my thing, number one. Very

[00:10:20] Amit: good. So, number two, I'm gonna say Pleasantville. Uh, so, uh, yeah, so Eddie Money grew up in Levittown, New York, and how much do you know about Levittown?

[00:10:32] Michael: Very little. You've explained this to me once before, but give it to me. So I do

[00:10:36] Amit: because as an American studies major in college, we really like spent quite a bit of time on Levittown. It's like a planned community or something. It's the first planned community that existed on Long Island. built by the Levitt family, but is essentially credited for the model of the modern American suburb.

[00:10:52] So it was the first really planned community and all sort of suburban sprawl that happened after that, they kind of point to the creation of Levittown as the origin of that. So with, you know, a very liberal arts education and lots of, you know, hippie professors, they pointed out to me that Levittown was like the destruction of the soul of the city.

[00:11:13] Hmm. Right? It was the death of the spirit. Yeah, it's cookie cutter. Cookie cutter. This is where Leave it to Beaver is born, and this is where culture, soul, and spirit die. Well,

[00:11:21] Michael: I certainly, I mean, it's interesting, the word generic has already come up a couple times in this conversation. It sounds like that's kind of what you're talking about.

[00:11:28] Amit: No, I'm actually talking about the exact opposite. Ah. I'm saying that, you know, yes, Eddie Money's lyrics specifically might have been generic, but he was by no means a generic person. Right. Right, you know, he was a long haired person that fled from a family of cops. Yeah. Right? What I like about this is the misinformation.

[00:11:46] The fact that he, uh, he rose from this supposed predestination of the quintessential definitive death of the spirit to have spirit, say what you will about generic lyrics or whatnot, but Eddie Money has spirit, and he has soul, and he followed his passion moved out west to Berkeley and started a rock and roll career, right?

[00:12:08] So there is no predestination in the fact that he was, came from Levittown, but also on a broader scale, how we, how we view, uh, cities and suburbs, right? And I'm a city snob. Yeah. Right. And so this is giving myself. You know, a little room that there is not this rigid, rigid distinction between spirit and soul arises from the city and the suburbs produce, you know, nothing but textbooks.

[00:12:33] And I like, I like the erasure of that history for Eddie Money.

[00:12:37] Michael: Yeah. I love that. It actually segues very well into my number three. Okay. I wrote simplicity. The Eddie Money story is kind of like a PG 13 rock biopic. Very much. Yeah, right? I mean, he grows up in Levittown, this, you know, Pleasantville like suburb that you talk about, and it sounded like he was sort of between Long Island, Queens, and Brooklyn.

[00:12:58] I didn't realize what a kind of like Brooklyn kind of guy he was, a New York guy, until I started listening to the interviews and hearing that accent. Which I

[00:13:06] Amit: think he like strung along purposefully all the end.

[00:13:08] Michael: I kind of agree, but so, you know, he comes from a family of cops, and there's this Story of, you know, his granddad, his dad and his brother were all cops.

[00:13:17] He was going to be in police Academy. I need to pause on the word police Academy too. Cause his original name is Mahoney. Like the whole, I actually went and it was like, was the Steve Gutenberg character in the police Academy movies inspired by the Eddie money story? I found no evidence for it, but I still have my suspicions.

[00:13:35] Let's help. Anyway, he goes into the police Academy decides this is not right for me. I read you that one joke the other day that was my favorite Eddie Money joke about this is that perhaps he couldn't hack it because he wasn't, what was it? It was like, couldn't get it.

[00:13:48] Amit: He wasn't getting tickets that were profitable and said he was giving away tickets to

[00:13:51] Michael: paradise.

[00:13:52] So anyways, that, you know, tears up his Jimi Hendrix poster as Eddie Money strikes out West, lands in San Francisco. Parties his ass off for 10 years between 1968. And then finally meets Bill Graham, this legendary rock promoter credited with bringing up the Grateful Dead and Jefferson airplane and a whole bunch of others.

[00:14:11] And then he, you know, has rock stardom hits, you know, Eddie money, and then falls deeply into drugs. We'll get more into that later. And then it has this like great late eighties comeback and then really moves into being, you know, a stay at home dad in so many ways, not stay at home dad, but like. you know, family man for, you know, the last few decades of his life.

[00:14:30] I mean, all of that, again, PG 13 rock biopic. When I say simplicity, it's not all that complicated, and I don't think we consider simplicity a virtue enough. I think that, you know, you and I are trying to extract wisdom from the lives of dead celebrities and so forth, and I think we're looking for nuances in places.

[00:14:50] I don't know that it needs to be all that complicated. I kind of want to go out and have fun, I want to have a career that's worthwhile, I want to dedicate myself to being a family man, and I want to have an interesting life. Eddie Money's story of simplicity is desirable to me on some level. Inside of it, there's human complexity and emotions and so forth, but I need to remind myself periodically that simplicity is, to me, a great virtue.

[00:15:14] And Eddie Money, both in personality and in his story, is just not all that complex. So that's my number three. Okay.

[00:15:21] Amit: My number four, I'm trying to, I'm trying to find a way to mix this into two, and I'm going to just go with the word sweetheart. Okay, so in, uh, in many interviews, he refers to people as sweethearts.

[00:15:32] He referred to Kevin James, who he said is a friend of his, as a sweetheart. He referred to Ronnie Spector, to even Bill Graham. He uses it authentically, though. And I like the way he uses it as a man. Because it's not a very masculine word. Yeah, I don't describe

[00:15:46] Michael: other dudes as sweethearts

[00:15:47] Amit: very often. Yeah, totally not.

[00:15:49] The substitute that we tend to hear a lot is like, bud or pal or whatever. But he doesn't even use it that way. He uses it... Sparingly, and only for the people that he actually really likes. And he uses it as a compliment. And I would love being called a sweetheart by Eddie money or somebody like

[00:16:05] Michael: that. If I'm not going to call you a sweetheart, I can't fit

[00:16:08] Amit: one in and sometime in the next, uh, in the next

[00:16:11] Michael: 45 minutes, I'll see if I can get there,

[00:16:13] Amit: but you know, it, it doesn't quite feel right when you hear it from like a Southern grandma.

[00:16:17] Right. It doesn't mean anything because you know, it's. being said all the time, but to hear it from Eddie Money, I think it's great. And I love that he dishes it out. And I love that that's in his heart to come out and to, to come and his friends.

[00:16:27] Michael: Yeah, that's a great one. Yeah. Sweetheart. Why don't you take number five?

[00:16:31] Okay. Sorry. You just seemed like you wanted to get something else in there. I did. I did. And thank

[00:16:37] Amit: you. Um, so you talked about, I want to go back. The song. And this is my Eddie money redemption. So generic lyrics, right? He's also referred to as corporate rock a lot. Um, you know, which is funny cause it was also called blue collar rock, but that's more about the origins.

[00:16:53] Right. But you know, just like the ultimate generic rock that has no meaning is just a sing along. But you take the song. I want to go back. And let's just look at the refrain for that song. I want to go back and do it all over again, but I can't go back. I know.

[00:17:17] I mean, to me, that's a lyric of acceptance, right? And especially the way that he sings it. It's like, yes, we all want to go back. We either want to relive some parts and we want to redo a lot of parts. Yeah. But like you and I were talking about the other day, you know, in, um, I forget what is the name of the prayer that they, the things, the serenity prayer, the accept the things I cannot change.

[00:17:39] That's embodied in this lyric, you know, that we always want to go back. It's on our minds way, way, way too much of the time. Yes. This simplicity of, but I can't go back. I know. Yeah. Done. Simple, perfect refrain of accept the things you cannot

[00:17:54] Michael: change. Or at least make an effort to, because it really does sound like instructions to himself.

[00:17:59] Yes. Oh, totally. Maybe we're all vulnerable to that on some level, but what is your number five specifically? Acceptance? That is, lyrics

[00:18:07] Amit: aren't generic. Yeah. And then I'm using this example of the display of acceptance. Yeah. The acceptance of what you cannot change, what you cannot relive, what you

[00:18:16] Michael: cannot redo.

[00:18:18] There was, uh, an article I read where they said you'd be hard pressed to come up with another rock star who transitioned from 70s into 80s so successfully. The one that leapt to my mind was Tom Petty, who I think actually does some of the same thing. And I think this came up in the Tom Petty episode.

[00:18:33] Like, there is a real simplicity to Tom Petty's lyrics as well. Yeah. I won't back down. That's not a complicated... message. I'm learning to fly, right? I mean, and there's a real poetry to great rock music that way. It doesn't need to be complicated words, but they can do so much work, right? To speak to us.

[00:18:52] Amit: Yeah. And I think there's something to be said for hundreds of people in a bar just saying to themselves, but I can't go back. Yeah. You know, I hope that's internalized.

[00:19:00] Michael: I agree. Wow. That's a great list. I'm a little surprised that we didn't get the sort of no filter on him on our five things. And maybe I'll just slip that in there real quickly.

[00:19:10] Okay. Well, just because I don't think he thinks much like you look at the interviews with him and he doesn't. He just answers. He just answers.

[00:19:17] Amit: And everything's a joke, too. He's a huckster. Yeah, totally. A lot of people

[00:19:21] Michael: judge success in a lot of strange ways. You said, uh, you'd know you've made it when you start making collect phone calls to your folks.

[00:19:28] Well, it's a habit, though. I still call collect. Hi, mom, this is collect. I got a master charge now and all that stuff. But, uh, I don't know. Nothing changes. Maybe that folds in with simplicity in a way, right? Like, I'm not gonna. Try and overthink anything. I'm just going to give you my answers when we talk.

[00:19:43] Actually, I think that does fold under simplicity pretty well. So, simplicity and no filter. Okay. Gonna amend my number three. We're

[00:19:50] Amit: giving the corollary to number three after five.

[00:19:53] Michael: Yes. All right, let's recap. Yeah. All right. Number one, I said earnestness.

[00:19:57] Amit: Number two, uh, Pleasantville slash Levittown. Nice.

[00:20:00] Michael: Number three, I said simplicity and no filter is part of that. Number four? Number four was Sweetheart. Sweetheart. And number five? Non

[00:20:09] Amit: generic

[00:20:09] Michael: acceptance. Beautiful. Great list. Let's pause.

[00:20:16] Amit: Michael, do you know one of the ways in which I'm cool? What did you have in mind? I have vinyl records. Oh, that is

[00:20:24] Michael: cool.

[00:20:24] Vinyl records are a lot of fun. I love studying the old covers and I love that the music is actually on the record,

[00:20:31] Amit: right? It's like been engraved. Totally. And you will never guess where I buy my vinyl records from. I would

[00:20:37] Michael: assume that you are going to

[00:20:40] Amit: That is incorrect. I exclusively get my vinyl records at Half Price Books.

[00:20:45] I'm sorry, you said Half Price Books, and you're talking about vinyl records? Yes, Half Price Books is more than books. Board games, vinyl records, CDs, movies, puzzles. And even brand new bestsellers.

[00:20:57] Michael: My goodness. It's so much more than just books. Yes. But when it comes to books, I do know that Half Price Books is the nation's largest new and used bookseller with 120 stores in 19 states.

[00:21:10] And Half Price Books is also online. At hpb. com.

[00:21:20] All right, category three. Malkovich, Malkovich. This category is named after the movie, Being John Malkovich, in which people can take a little portal into John Malkovich's mind and they can have a front row seat to his experiences. I think I'm going to go first, 1981. Yeah, two decades later. Okay, so by the late 70s, uh, Eddie Money is pretty hard into drugs.

[00:21:43] And I want to zone in on his overdose experience. Yes. But there's a specific part of this. So, the story goes, uh, he was looking for some coke at a party. He has the dubious distinction of being the first rock star to publicly overdose on fentanyl. in 1981. The way he tells the story, somebody said it was some synthetic something.

[00:22:03] He thought it was maybe a quaalude. He went out like a light. His nerves didn't twitch, ended up kilting the sciatic nerve in his left leg. And he couldn't walk for 11 months and blew out his kidneys. He walked away with a limp for the rest of his life after this. Here's the moment I want to hone in on.

[00:22:21] It sounds like he was out and he. Regains a little bit of consciousness while he is in the hospital. And the way he tells the story, I can remember being on the operating table, and I'm looking at all the doctors with these masks, and they're operating on me, and Baby Hold On comes on. the radio. They had it on the operating room.

[00:22:42] These people started singing Baby Hold On, and the one guy said to the other, this is Eddie Money, this is the kid on the radio, and they're going, oh shit, I can't believe

[00:22:51] Amit: that. They're singing Baby Hold On where they're trying to like, make the baby hold on? Correct. Okay.

[00:22:56] Michael: This is why it's my Malkovich.

[00:23:14] He's written this song that is about Hanging on to love, or, you know, the kind of like, desperate feeling that whatever, you know, you're connected with is falling apart. And he's, in this moment, clinging to life. I mean, I, I don't know when the last time you were in the hospital on the operating table was, but that is a disorienting, terrifying experience.

[00:23:36] And, just the coincidence of that, is, I don't know, how do you not find meaning in that, right? How do you not see... Something bigger than you. Yeah. But he's also got a, you know, I mean, he's got, who knows what drugs are in him or what they're doing to him. I just wonder what sort of like ethereal state he's in on the operating table.

[00:23:59] I have intense curiosity about what's going on in his mind in this moment. Yeah. That's my Malkovich. Love it. I thought you might like that.

[00:24:08] Amit: Mine also has to do with the song title, Take Me Home Tonight. Yeah. Which became a movie, uh, starring Chris Pratt and Anna Faris. I saw this. Yes. So it was filmed in 2007, but the song was somewhat an inspiration for the movie.

[00:24:21] The song, however, did not appear in the movie. However, Eddie Money created the song, which later became a movie. On the set of this movie is where Chris Pratt and Anna Faris met. They did marry as a result of meeting on the set of this movie, and they were together until 2019. Okay. Yeah. And in a interview in 2018, I saw with Eddie Money, with a guy named Andrew Reeder, he tells the story to Eddie Money, he's saying, you know this movie you did, uh, or this movie about your, this movie with your song title, Take Me Home Tonight, you know, that's where Chris Pratt and Anna Faris met, and Eddie Money didn't have his, like, quick, no filter, huckster reaction to it.

[00:25:01] He had just, like, a quick pause, he was like, oh, oh, cool. It was actually this, this unfiltered reaction, but without words. Yeah. And what I love about it as a Malkovich moment is the very subtle, hidden impact of your life. Yeah. It trickles down. So far, you created a song, that song became a movie, these actors were hired on a set, they met, fell in love.

[00:25:23] Would all of this ever have happened if you didn't make the song? More likely not, right? So I love the hidden impact of this story Not just for Eddie money in this validation of this song that he made 35 years prior to this revelation moment, but I like it for everyone. I have a similar story I have a friend back when I worked at match.

[00:25:42] com This was you know 2005 and you know He had just moved to a new town and was wanted to like get out and meet people and he was like, you know I'll try I'll try match. This was a completely different era than it is now. This was early days. Yeah. And he sends me an email and he's like, I'll try it. Can you make it free?

[00:25:57] And I was like, yeah, I can do that. I mean, my, in my junior marketing manager authority, I can, I can make it free. And so I

[00:26:04] Michael: gave him a moment for

[00:26:05] Amit: a young Amit. Yes. So I gave him a subscription and within a month he meets a girl. They, they sort of become a friendship and then later date, but are. Now married, with two kids, and live a very happy existence.

[00:26:17] And they still talk about me as the ones that, quote, introduce them. Yeah. Right? I did nothing at all but respond to my friend's email and, like, ask my superlative to, to comp the account. Yeah. But it's this subtle, hidden impact. And if I look for meaning in my life, like, meaningful moments, what did I actually do?

[00:26:34] That's one of those that I can really claim. Yeah. But it's such subtle, indirect impact. Yeah. And I wish we all... knew that. Because we all do it in some way. It's like, it's a whole butterfly effect. It's like, every time we take a step or every time we flap our wings, it is reverberating somewhere. And a lot of that is positive.

[00:26:54] This goes back to what Maya Angelou said to Tupac. Like, do you have any idea that the entire history of the world converged upon you to make you and make this moment happen? And make you important. Yes. Yeah. And this is what Eddie Money got to learn at that moment. And most of us don't get to learn that.

[00:27:10] But if you can just believe it, if you can just believe in that spirit, that every step you take, every action you do, every time you don't sit still, it is reverberating throughout the universe, and very well could have positive, really, really, really meaningful impact, or minor, minor, minor positive impact.

[00:27:29] But it's a way to remember, to guide through life, and to just move.

[00:27:36] Michael: I love that, man. That's really cool. Okay, category four, love and marriage. How many marriages? Also, how many kids? And is there anything public about these relationships? This is a little confusing because there are two marriages. The first marriage was in 1984 to, uh, Margot Lee Walker.

[00:27:53] It's very hard to find out any information about her or the marriage. That couldn't even figure out exactly when they got divorced. I think it's 1985 because in 1985 is when Eddie meets his second wife, Laurie Harris. They ended up getting married in 1989. So the first marriage was when Eddie was 35. Uh, the second marriage, Eddie is about 40 years old.

[00:28:15] I found this quote that I love from a People Magazine article from, uh, Laurie. She says, quote, When we met, I really didn't know who he was. I used to get him mixed up with John Mellencamp. So she was sober at this time, and he was attracted to her sobriety. Eddie Money continued to struggle with drugs and alcohol, although he did end up in a 12 step program around 2001, making promises to his family, saying, I'm going to get sober.

[00:28:40] Oh, so

[00:28:41] Amit: the baby hold on coma didn't. didn't sober him

[00:28:43] Michael: up. Not completely. It sounded like, I mean, I think he was at that point, it woke him up and I think he was trying to cool off, but I think he was caught up in addiction and alcoholism, you know, inevitably. Right. So I think he was trying to cool it, but couldn't.

[00:28:58] And he eventually, um, claims lasting sobriety somewhere in the early two thousands. Okay. But I think it does sound like Laurie was a very big part of that. She was a former model. Uh, You know, this reality TV show that they were in, this was sort of inspired by the Osbournes, and it came about pretty late.

[00:29:17] Uh, it was really only a year before Eddie Money died that this show was there, and it sounds like kind of corny in places. I gotta say, when I saw Laurie and Eddie in the public appearances, he's a great husband, it seems like. He just talks about how beautiful his wife is, and, you know. Also, like, five children.

[00:29:34] Yeah, mostly musicians now. Mostly musicians played in the band. I think that's the thing to talk about. Honestly, that was what stuck out to me. And I think this is the one thing I want to talk about kids in the band. Yeah. There's a part of me that's like. I love it, right? There's something wholesome, you know, about inviting your children onto the stage to play music with you.

[00:29:57] I think that's, in one way, a beautiful thing. I also think it's got to be hard to be the kid of a celebrity. Yeah. Just the expectations are always going to be so high. I can't figure out if you're doing them a solid or if you're... Cutting them off at the knees by inviting them to play on stage with you. I know you're a big Lucas Nelson fan.

[00:30:18] Yeah. Yeah, we were talking about that the other day. Yeah, and I do think Lucas is like blooming into his own, you know, musician. I think he's going to have a great legacy and a great catalog. And there's lots of, you know, musicians out there where they are descended from family, right? Or they're part of a lineage.

[00:30:37] Yep. But I don't, you know, I think it's, this is a hard thing to know if that's the right thing to do or not. And I don't know, what's your take on that with the Eddie Money family?

[00:30:46] Amit: I mean, I think he did it with the right intentions, right? Because his kids wanted to be musicians and he had the power to literally put them on stage.

[00:30:53] Right. But are, are you misguiding them, uh, in a direction that, that is just following in your own footsteps that may not be right for them? Literally interjecting on your own songs. I don't know, I'm conflicted. I guess I will give it to him as it seems like the right fatherly thing to do. Yeah. Especially if your kids express interest and you have that ability to indulge in it.

[00:31:15] Michael: But are you adding pressure to the pressure of already being the child of a celebrity? Yeah. You know what I mean? That's where I'm a little bit like, uh. Good intentions, and maybe it's the right thing to do, but I don't know, it also feels a little bit perhaps misguided. Yeah. And I, I think about this because, I mean, think about betting money, for Christ's sakes, you know, came from this lineage of cop family,

[00:31:37] Amit: right?

[00:31:38] If he did not, yeah, if he did not bloom into his own person, he wouldn't have been who

[00:31:41] Michael: he was. Right, and, uh, you know, I come from a family of lawyers, I've chosen my own path, and I'm sort of proud of that. I mean, I think that there is this real tension with parenting, where at some point you've got to, like, say, I connect with you, and I love you, and I like you, but, uh, you know, and I like who you've become, but I also want to not have you be me, you know what I mean?

[00:32:01] Yeah. We don't know enough about it, but it was something that, I don't know, something to think about. Yeah, I,

[00:32:06] Amit: I guess what I would say is, you know, it, it would seem like you should, you should encourage to spread your wings, and if the child chooses to flock back at ones that are mature enough to do that.

[00:32:15] Then that's okay. And maybe that's what happened here. That,

[00:32:17] Michael: I guess that's the lesson. And as much as I'm looking for lessons here, I want to make sure I've given them that, that opportunity. Um, while still keeping things open, whatever, whatever that looks like for a given family. What would you like to talk about?

[00:32:31] What is your take? If you have one thing, one comment to make about this love and marriage category here, what was your reaction to what you saw?

[00:32:39] Amit: He got it right the second time. That's all I'll say. Pretty simple. Yeah.

[00:32:43] Michael: Okay, Category 5, Net Worth. I saw 20 million. 20 million! Okay, so here's my reaction to that.

[00:32:50] Eddie had a lot of money. You know, like, there was 10 years where he's broke in the Bay Area and everybody called him, like, Eddie No Money? I think they called him Freddy

[00:32:59] Amit: No Money just to, like, double down

[00:33:01] Michael: on the insult. Here was my take on this 20 million. I think it actually feels about right. He bitched about not having big money, not bitched about it.

[00:33:09] But I saw in an interview or two, he's like, somehow I missed out on the big money. So I was expecting less in a way. 20 million feels about right to me. Yeah.

[00:33:20] Amit: For a guy whose career like took off in 1977. That's, you know, 20 plus years of royalties. Yes,

[00:33:26] Michael: but he is beloved enough by fans, if not, certainly not critics, but definitely by fans that anytime he performs.

[00:33:33] Like he's gonna sell tickets. Yeah. So there was a world in which he could have had significantly more money, perhaps. Yes. So, I don't know, 20 felt like, ultimately about right. It was more than I expected after hearing him say, I thought I was going to be in big money, because 20 is big money to

[00:33:50] Amit: me. Yeah, he was self deprecating towards you.

[00:33:52] He's like, I have to feed five kids, you know? That's why I tour. Right. But he's in no way Eddie, you've got 20, 20M in the bank. He's got

[00:33:57] Michael: a mansion. I don't know. Like, this, this is the right number for Eddie Money. I agree. Yeah. Okay, category six. Simpsons, Saturday Night Live, or Halls of Fame. This category is a measure of how famous a person is.

[00:34:09] We include both guest appearances on SNL or The Simpsons as well as impersonations. So, SNL, he was the musical guest in 1978. Oh. I know. The same year Fred Willard hosted. Same year, but not the same episode. I was kind of hoping. Yeah, we already know. It was Devo with Fred Willard. That's right, of course.

[00:34:26] Simpsons, It's great. It's a legendary one. Yeah. Episode called Homer Loves Flanders in Season Five. And Homer bangs on the radio, and it clicks over to Two Tickets to Paradise. And he starts singing along, and then they also melds the guitar riff. Nir, Ner, Ner, Ner Ner, Ner, Ner, Ner, Ner, Ner, Ner, Ner Ner, Ner, Ner Exit in Guitar Riff.

[00:34:48] Great Simpsons appearance. Eddie Money didn't voice himself, but his song's there. Here's something you're gonna like. He was on Arsenio Hall. Was he? Yeah, Season 1, Episode 8. I couldn't find any video of it, but it's listed on IMDB. Lovely. He's in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, but no Hollywood star. Okay.

[00:35:06] How famous is Eddie Money?

[00:35:09] Amit: He's got the name recognition because of the name. The name is so memorable, right? Because it's money. It's, um. Well,

[00:35:14] Michael: and Eddie has this like casual, Eddie Money, like it's got, you know, it's, it's really a great name. Yeah. I think

[00:35:20] Amit: he's famous. I think you can prompt anybody, you know, probably age 35 to 60 and say, do you know who Eddie Money is?

[00:35:27] And they'll say, yes. They say, oh, what song did he sing? I'm not sure. Will be the answer probably from about 60 to 70%. I

[00:35:33] Michael: wonder about that. I mean, his music is earwormy. Like it really gets in your head and stays in there. Yeah,

[00:35:39] Amit: but do you associate it with the name or is it just kind of like that was one of those 70s, 80s

[00:35:43] Michael: hits?

[00:35:44] I don't know. It's a good question. I'm probably not the one to ask because it's a, to me, a sticky name and ear warming music and you put those two things together and you know, he occupies a certain place in my psyche like it or not. How famous is he? I don't know. I mean, he, he is not going to be, I don't think remembered as.

[00:36:03] Even though he's in the rock and roll hall of fame. I, I kind of feel like he's Can it kind of be in a forgotten category? Yes. I don't think we're going to be talking about him 20, 30 years

[00:36:14] Amit: from now. No. I think the songs may survive another 10 or so, but even then, they're not going to have the name

[00:36:19] Michael: attached to it.

[00:36:20] Yeah. So in that way, I think he's sort of like overrepresented in our categories of fame. Yeah. You know?

[00:36:27] Amit: Because he fit in the era, but he doesn't necessarily fit in, in legacy categories. Mm hmm.

[00:36:32] Michael: That's exactly right. Pretty famous,

[00:36:34] Amit: though. Yes, and I mean, Two Tickets to Paradise, in addition to the Simpsons reference, it was in The Office, it was in Sideways, I mean, it's, it's been

[00:36:42] Michael: everywhere.

[00:36:43] Let's move on. Category 7, Over Under. In this category, we look at the generalized life expectancy for the year somebody was born to see if they beat the house odds. And to look for signs of graceful aging. So, the life expectancy of a man born in 1949 was 73. 2 years. Eddie was 70 years old, so under. Under.

[00:37:03] By about three years. He does not get high scores for graceful aging. No. The years of being a rock star and, uh, he's a haggard looking son of a bitch by the end of it. Like, I mean, you, you know, wearing a lot of makeup, too. He's in 12 step programs. He looks like somebody who's going to be in the 12 step program.

[00:37:20] Yeah. That sounds a little judgmental, but you know what I mean? Sure. And

[00:37:23] Amit: you're talking on the physical, the physical level though, but I, there was energy through the end. There was touring, you know, up until the end. Yeah. So there was definitely that survival. There was that

[00:37:32] Michael: maximization. There was clarity in the eyes too.

[00:37:34] I think on some level, I mean, you know, you sort of do see, I don't know, light behind the eyes in a way. Yeah. But the body took its toll. Yeah. And, and it shows up in the kind of frizzy hair too. Yeah. Not quite Gene Wilder, but it's getting there. Yeah. It's

[00:37:49] Amit: a sad one though. I mean, he did lose to cancer, but he was still working and he was still working hard.

[00:37:52] He was still able bodied. You can call him a little frail and frizzy, but you know, this reality show was only one season

[00:37:58] Michael: in. It's a little premature. It's a little bit, but I mean, if you were to go back to 1984 and say, is this man going to make it to 70, you know, probably would have said unlikely.

[00:38:08] Amit: This man that continues to do cocaine after a near fatal overdose.

[00:38:11] Michael: Correct. Yes. Right? I mean, I think that, good run given the hard livin Yep. You know? I would agree. I would agree. But a little premature. And a little sad. Okay. Let's take another break. Amit, have you heard about the Shirley, You Can't

[00:38:28] Amit: Be Serious podcast? Uh, Shirley, I have, Michael. Um, no, I, I, I actually have, and I'm, I'm, I'm into it.

[00:38:35] So this is, you're just now hearing about it? Well, yes,

[00:38:38] Michael: nobody told me about it. I found it on my own. You found it on your own, organically?

[00:38:42] Amit: I did. It often comes up as a podcast that's recommended for people that like our podcast. Well, so

[00:38:47] Michael: Jason Colvin and James D. Graves, they're the host, and usually what they do is they pit two iconic movies or albums against each other, uh, and pick which is best.

[00:38:56] So like

[00:38:57] Amit: Jaws versus Jurassic Park or Appetite for

[00:39:00] Michael: Destruction versus Back in Black. Uh, but kind of like

[00:39:03] Amit: us, these guys do their homework. They're really well researched and they're really funny. They've started this new thing, which I really like, are these episodes dedicated to top five lists, which are things like top five TV theme songs from the 90s.

[00:39:16] I just really dig that. It's a great nostalgia ride for me. So, uh, highly recommend. List of five. There's

[00:39:21] Michael: something to that. We ought to, we ought to notch that away for later. So the Surely You Can't Be Serious podcast, check it out wherever you get your podcasts. Surely is spelled S U R E L Y. All right, Category 8, Man in the Mirror.

[00:39:35] What do we think they thought about their own reflection? This category is in some sense about self perception and maybe even self acceptance. All right, I don't know how many photographs you saw where he's giving the blue steel look from Zoolander. Yes, well he does have like very unique eyes. Yeah, very much so, but I mean he's also got the pursed lips.

[00:39:55] It's kind of like it's... Kind of hilarious. Yeah, it was trained almost. Yeah, very much. So he's also got like a kind of New York cockiness, you know, yes I think that there's such vulnerability when you get underneath all of that, that it does feel like a lot of work to cover up some insecurity here. Yeah.

[00:40:15] So my instinct is to say I don't think he actually liked it all that much. And I think the struggle with substance abuse that was, you know, many decades also sort of speaks to that. That the hallmark of, you know, addiction is like... You can't face yourself in the mirror in the morning, quite literally. So, man in the mirror, I'm saying no, he didn't like it.

[00:40:35] Even though he has a certain like sexual attractiveness, you know? I think he like, that's part of where the passion earnestness is coming from. It's a, it's to compensate for something deeper inside.

[00:40:48] Amit: Yeah. You know, he held onto the long hair and the chains forever. Yes. And the other thing I noticed is that, you know, he used to talk about all the groupies and all the women in every cities that he had.

[00:40:57] And I, I don't think. And almost like he was bragging. Yeah. Or, or he was reassuring himself. Right. Right. And I, I don't think, uh, I don't think a self accepted person really does that. You know, obviously that's on a continuum. You do that. At times. But if we're, if we're making one stab at it, there's seems to be a prevailing insecurity.

[00:41:16] Michael: I think he struggled with self acceptance and that's okay. And it comes out in his art at times and perhaps some of the best, you know, in the best way, you know, I think it's actually something of a defining characteristic with it. Correct. Yeah. Let's,

[00:41:27] Amit: let's be clear here. A no here doesn't mean bad. A no can be an indicator of, of growth.

[00:41:32] Michael: Yeah. Or even creative expression in his case. Yeah. Yeah. The other thing I would point out with man in the mirror. The loosened tie look, which comes up quite a bit. Yes. Like you see him in a suit, but the tie loosened or not knotted up properly or whatever. Looks a little forced to me at places like he's really trying to convey a.

[00:41:50] Yeah, I'm a relaxed blue collar kind of guy. Just loosen the tie. So much so that it's like almost a joke. Yeah.

[00:41:57] Amit: You know what I mean? Okay. I see your interpretation of it. I like it for aesthetic reasons.

[00:42:02] Michael: I think I would have liked it if you saw it every now and then. I saw it in a lot of pictures. Yes. I'm going to put on the tie and then I'm going to loosen it as quickly as possible.

[00:42:11] Yeah. But it does communicate a lot about him. Right. I mean, I think this whole blue collar rock star thing, loosened tie, you kind of picture him, I don't know, businessman in a dive bar, right. Ready to sing karaoke. Yeah. Right. It's

[00:42:24] Amit: this, it's this in this corporate rock, like you said, blue collar rock, which is speaks to his origins.

[00:42:28] Corporate rock is who it speaks to. Yes. They say, but it is that, um, that idea, right. That the, the alarm sounds at 5 PM and back when people were in offices all the time that immediately you loosen the tie and go down to happy

[00:42:40] Michael: hour. Absolutely. And you could see any money. Waiting for you in the bar there.

[00:42:44] Yes. Okay. Category nine, outgoing message, like man in the mirror. How do we think they felt about the sound of their own voice when they heard it on an answering machine? And would they have the humility to record it themselves or would they have used the default setting? While I think there's some real questions about self acceptance with the image, I think he likes his New York accent.

[00:43:04] Loves it. I love it. And leans into it. I also think, like, he has a real connection with fans. He knows who his people are, and I think he's got a lot of humility around it. I think he would love to say, you've reached the voicemail of Eddie Money. Yeah. a voicemail. And he

[00:43:21] Amit: would throw a joke in there, or a pun

[00:43:23] Michael: of some sort.

[00:43:24] Yeah. A lot of dad humor, especially in the latter

[00:43:26] Amit: years. Totally. So it's not humility, because the guy's full of braggadocio. Right. Because he needs that for the security. We saw that. But there is an accessibility to him, and a connectivity. To him and, and

[00:43:37] Michael: the outside world. Actually, let me dig into that just a second.

[00:43:39] So humility and braggadocio, are they opposites or can they coexist? You're right. We talk about this as a category of humility on some level. I think that there is a lot of compensation and a lot of braggadocio to use your words. But I also think that there is this. Actually, at the root of it, true everyman quality, that maybe comes with humility, or at least comes with like, Alright, I can feel above it and kind of egotistical at sometimes, but only so much so.

[00:44:06] I think he's above it, but not that above it. What

[00:44:08] Amit: made

[00:44:08] Michael: you decide to settle down? I mean, you've been a bachelor all this time. Well, I'm settling down, I guess, because I've... I've met every girl in every city in the United States

[00:44:20] and Europe. He has too. And that's telling the truth, huh? Yeah, she's just real pretty and I figure I'm really lucky. And I figure there's really more to life than just, uh, running around and being cool, you know? I mean, my real name is Mahoney. Eddie Money doesn't want to get married. Eddie Mahoney does.

[00:44:33] Amit: So, yes, they can coexist, it's not often.

[00:44:36] Right. Uh, and I think there's a beauty in that. Yeah. Right? That you can have both braggadocio and humility, you just can't turn it up way too much. Right.

[00:44:46] Michael: So, yeah, I think it's about how much distance there is between the two, maybe. Okay. Category 10, Control Z. This is where we look for the big do overs.

[00:44:56] Things in life you might have done differently. Mine

[00:45:00] Amit: was, mine was Yermalkovich,

[00:45:02] Michael: actually. Yeah, and he mentioned it. I came up in an interview, it was like, I really wish I hadn't done that fentanyl in 1980, or 81, whatever it was. Uh, you know, I think he did feel like he missed out on big money somehow, and I think that that's tied up with his addiction and alcoholism.

[00:45:17] You know, it's funny, he gets asked this a few times, and you can find pieces of it, like little pieces of things in interviews. I would suspect that the biggest one for him, if you were really to, you know, hold his nose to it, probably be... Addiction in the 90s when his kids are youngest. I suspect he's one of those guys who wishes he would have been there a little bit more for the kids when they're at a young age.

[00:45:44] I guess I see that a lot. A lot of people who are, who say that, you know, they, as their children become adults, they develop closer relationships and kind of like, man, those years when they were kids. I'd also say as a dad of I'm talking about me here, of young children, that can be really hard. I connect with my kids in a big way.

[00:46:02] They can also, you know, there can be aspects of it that are hard to kind of get down on their level and stay on their level for sustained periods of time. Yeah. So, you know, I think it's something that a lot of parents can beat themselves up over. I suspect he... Really beat himself up over

[00:46:19] Amit: this. Yeah, because he wasn't what we'd call a social drinker, even like a social binge drinker.

[00:46:23] Right. He was an addict. Yes. You know, and these are hard

[00:46:26] Michael: drugs, too. That's right. And he's also on the road. I mean, he's also a touring act. Yes. I suspect it's as simple as he wished he'd gotten sober earlier. All right. Category 11. Second to last category, cocktail, coffee, or cannabis. This is where we ask, which one would we most want to do with our dead celebrity?

[00:46:44] It's maybe a question of what drug sounds like the most fun to partake with this person, or another philosophy is that a particular kind of drug might allow access to a part of them we're most curious about. What's you got here? I

[00:46:56] Amit: don't want cocktail, because I don't think I can stand his jokes. Yeah. I don't need the deep interacts with the cannabis.

[00:47:02] Okay. Uh, I think it can come out with a coffee. And this is what I'm curious about is that the contrast of the 70s, 80s, 90s, Eddie Money and the later family, Eddie Money. The 2000s to 2010s. Correct. And you did, you know, you said that in the early years of his kids lives, he was still dealing with addiction, but he did eventually beat it.

[00:47:20] Yes. Right. And I think that that was necessary. But in the 2010s. And so forth. He seemed to really enjoy it. He seemed to enjoy having this five children. Yeah. He talks about, you know, like putting pork chops on the table and going to the grocery store. What I would wanna sit down and talk to him about is if he ever saw that mm, if eighties, nineties, Eddie money could have ever envisioned that because the happiness that he seems to have found in the resolve.

[00:47:44] is in such stark contrast to how he lived before. That's interesting. So I just want to know if it was a complete unknown to him, or if he saw it as a possible

[00:47:54] Michael: outcome. I think that's a good omen. Uh, I actually did go cannabis. I was thinking, like, do you remember in high school or college, like, smoking a pot in, like, those metal pipes?

[00:48:04] Like, a pack of bowl? You know? A

[00:48:05] Amit: metal pipe? I thought there was

[00:48:06] Michael: always glass. Uh, no, I'm thinking, like, I'm, I'm going back to the 90s. Like, I, I remember smoking pot, like, like pack a bowl and a metal pipe. Okay. Um, probably. I don't think I was around

[00:48:15] Amit: it as much as you were in the 90s. Yeah, maybe not. You

[00:48:18] Michael: were a cooler kid than I was.

[00:48:19] I was just more hot. I didn't. That doesn't make me cooler. Okay. Believe me, the self acceptance vis a vis Luke Perry was not there. Okay. I don't necessarily want to be super high with him. I would like to slow him down a little. He's got kind of a rapid clep. I also think it is interesting to me that he was in, you know, Haight Ashbury and part of the counterculture scene in the late 60s into the 70s and that he That he actually came up through Bill Graham.

[00:48:46] I would like to, like, relive some of that journey. And I think I'd like to hear some of the stories of what it was like to be, you know, in the hate in the late 60s and early 70s. And what he saw, specifically. Because it's not obvious to me that that was gonna be his path. So I'm a little curious about that.

[00:49:04] And, as I, you know, said at the top, I... Kind of like this romantic nostalgia of him. I, I think I would have liked to have heard more about that, you know, passing the ball back and forth. But I think what I'm going for here overall is nostalgia. And, you know, I, I would want to lean into that with him. He's a good example of that tendency.

[00:49:24] He embodies that tendency in a way towards nostalgia. And that I think I could benefit from like, Having a conversation about like, what is that all about? And is this a good tendency or not? Or where is it problem? Does that make sense? All right, we've arrived final category. The Vanderbeek named after James Vanderbeek, who famously said in varsity blues, I don't want your life.

[00:49:48] What do you think, Amit? Do you want Eddie Money's life? Case

[00:49:51] Amit: against is, the music kind of stopped after the 80s. It's not being created, right? And so the rest of the career, the 30 years following that, is just replaying the hits.

[00:50:02] Michael: That I think I would hate. Yeah, he even actually said, because the song Walk on Water, that na na na song, like the part of it where he has to sing it, That was supposed to be instrumental, and I forget who it was.

[00:50:14] Somebody didn't show up that day, so he had to sing Na Na Na, and now he's got to do it for the rest of his life. And he said he gets a little tired of it, but that's what the fans want. Correct. Okay, but what are you speaking to specifically with that? This is... The

[00:50:26] Amit: job. I mean, I think the first 10 years of the job, you know, were fun and exciting.

[00:50:32] I don't think it sounds very appealing after that. Is it better than a lot of other options? Is it better than the actual corporate side of the corporate rock? Probably, but that's the case against. The journey to get to where he got was risky. I wouldn't want to experience that level of dependency, those near death experiences.

[00:50:51] Hard living. Yeah, too hard living. You know, there's, there's a fantasy of the rock and roll lifestyle, but you don't want fentanyl in your veins and not be able to move your leg for 12

[00:51:00] Michael: months. It's a little

[00:51:01] Amit: immature. Yes. Um, the resolve is beautiful. Right. Uh, it took him quite a while to get there, but for me, in contrast to say what I said about Leonard Cohen, who was not dealing with substances, but was dealing with a different disease.

[00:51:16] Yes. Uh, you know, I, it took too long for me in, in Leonard Cohen's eyes. Eddie Money got, he got there quicker. So I think he got there enough to have the full enjoyment of life. Yeah. Um. I liked it. I believed in the happiness. You know, as much as I believe it when he says sweetheart when referring to Kevin James, I believe his happiness when he says he's happy.

[00:51:37] And for that, in totality, it's not 100%, it's probably not even a 70%, it may not even be a 60%. But yeah, I want your life, Eddie Mooney. Yeah,

[00:51:48] Michael: yeah. I kind of lean in that direction too, that this is a more good than not, overall. You know, this is an exciting life. I also think that I was surprised by how beloved he is of his peers.

[00:52:04] Like, there were some tributes from Elton John to Kid Rock, right? And people really were like, I'm going to miss this man. And he was a sweetheart. And I think that looks genuine. And I... It did look like he achieved a level of relational wealth that you and I talk about that matters quite a bit. I'm hung up on this nostalgia thing a little bit.

[00:52:28] I think there's not just a little bit of regret, I think that there's a lot of regret. I do think that he gets to a place of real gratitude and gets to experience many years of gratitude and gets to be on stage with his children. And that's exciting and fun and great and that, you know, the way he connects with fans, I mean, he's got that for forever and that they're there for him, that's gotta feel pretty good.

[00:52:51] More validating than most, in a way. But I do really wonder how much he was ever in the present, you know, maybe in those last 20 years, he is a little bit more, but he does feel a little bit disconnected from the moment throughout a lot of his life. He's not where he wants to be when he's in Levittown and in New York and as a teenager, you know, it takes a while before he takes off as a rockstar and then he falls into all those trappings of fame quickly.

[00:53:21] Quickly, his most successful music is backwards looking in a way. And I guess I'm holding all of this to a higher standard, but that's, that's actually a reasonably strong case against for me, because I do think that I want to be in the present, I think a little bit more than he was on average. Yeah.

[00:53:41] Amit: Which requires evolution

[00:53:42] Michael: and artistry.

[00:53:43] Yeah, it also requires like self reflection and work on yourself at a younger age than I think he did it. It didn't sound like he really began working on himself in earnest until, you know, his fifties. Yeah. It's a little late, right? And it makes sense because why would you, but I don't know. I want to get started a little earlier on all these things, on self acceptance, on building relational wealth.

[00:54:09] So, so I'm, I think I'm a no. Here. He's, he's, he's really right in the middle, because there's a lot about this story I do like, and I kind of want to live a movie. You know, and this is a movie. And that's cool. That's interesting. I don't think it's for me. It's not in the present enough, and for whatever reason, today I'm feeling like I need that.

[00:54:29] That's a big part of where I want to be. I guess I'm also really afraid about the trappings of, you know, romantic nostalgia. And maybe that's it. Maybe he's just a little too caught up in them for me.

[00:54:42] Amit: Okay. One ticket to paradise, one no.

[00:54:46] Michael: Well, I don't think we've made the case for the ticket to paradise yet.

[00:54:49] No, that's next. I think that's next. Amit, you are Eddie Money. You have died and you are standing in front of St. Peter, the universal proxy for the afterlife with, I assume two tickets to paradise and some choice words. Yes. You have an opportunity to make your case to St. Peter for What was your grand contribution to the stream of life?

[00:55:14] Amit: So, St. Peter, they labeled me as blue collar rock or corporate rock. Both different meanings, but all intended to be somewhat insulting. That my music has no purpose. But let me try something with you. I'm gonna say a few words. Baby, hold on. Take me home tonight. Two tickets to paradise. As I say those words, there's a song playing through your ears.

[00:55:39] There's an energy running through your veins. Running through your body. That... is Vitality. Those songs were played millions and millions of times in cars, in bars, in radios, at parties, at weddings, at bar mitzvahs, and each time they were played, Vitality and life ran through the body. That is what I did. I produced life affirming feelings.

[00:56:09] Let me in.

[00:56:13] Michael: Don't leave yet. We need you, Famous Engraving listeners. We would love for you to participate in our opening quiz where we reveal the dead celebrity. If you're game for it, please email us at hello at famous and gravy. com. If you're enjoying our show, please tell your friends. You can find us on Twitter or X or whatever it is called these days.

[00:56:34] We are also now on threads. Our handle is at famous and gravy. We have a

[00:56:38] newsletter you can sign up for on our website, famous and gravy.

[00:56:42] com. Famous Gravy was created by Amit Kapoor and me, Michael Osborne. This episode was produced by Jacob Weiss. Original theme music by Kevin Strang. Thank you so much for listening.

[00:56:53] See you next time.